| what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them | |
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+28Thunter Benny T mrwvsportsman jedster1 captainrickiii Garnog randyrzr handymancanfixit ohiofishman commando64 smith700 bubba53 tracker1 kennylacy BRP RIDER porkchop big g Jet pit dog Rainemaker Hump bcfatvs Bobby D wvprowler Finzup Ron(09rzr) neuromax bigben129 32 posters |
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bigben129
![bigben129](https://2img.net/u/1913/21/04/90/avatars/993-61.jpg)
Number of posts : 773 Age : 44 Location : Elizabeth Wv Registration date : 2011-02-09
![what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them April 13th 2011, 12:37 pm | |
| I am curious about tires for the hopefully soon to be mine sxs. i just replaced the stockers on my 2004 vinson (2600miles) with some itp mudlites i really like them they are aggressive sometimes a little too aggressive. it is a lot harder to "play" with those tires for sure a power slide even in the snow is a lot harder to do and maintain LOL i see that lots of folks like the bighorn, is that just because it comes stock on some things? or is it really that good? i really like the looks of the ITP baja cross reminds me of a mud terrain tire for my truck. i also like the looks of the GBC afterburner tire? all of the nicer tires are exspensive, so i guess i want to know bang for the buck? which ones get good traction, let you play a little, and last a long time LOL Is there such a tire? ![what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them 900375](https://2img.net/u/1913/21/04/90/smiles/900375.gif) | |
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neuromax
![neuromax](https://2img.net/h/i18.photobucket.com/albums/b136/TTB2000/Daryl%20J/pp_misc_065.gif)
Number of posts : 2775 Age : 54 Location : Greensboro, NC Registration date : 2009-02-14
![what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them April 13th 2011, 12:57 pm | |
| I think you will get nearly all the same answers on here, BIGHORNS all the way. Its a great all around tire, does very well in all conditions and they wear really well. Its also not too expensive of a tire. They are also 8ply and very tough. | |
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Guest Guest
![Anonymous](https://2img.net/u/1913/21/04/90/avatars/gallery/red_rz11.gif)
![what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them April 13th 2011, 1:55 pm | |
| bighorns
but if you like to play in the deep mud they will not work that well for you but they are the best all around tire out. |
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Guest Guest
![Anonymous](https://2img.net/u/1913/21/04/90/avatars/gallery/red_rz11.gif)
![what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them April 13th 2011, 4:40 pm | |
| I agree with Bush! Bighorns are awesome. The tires Bobby D looked pretty awesome as well! |
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Ron(09rzr)
Number of posts : 1149 Age : 39 Location : avella pa Registration date : 2011-03-09
![what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them April 13th 2011, 4:43 pm | |
| After owning big horns and terracross I bought a set of gbc dirt commanders and will never own the 1st two again | |
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Finzup
![Finzup](https://2img.net/u/1913/21/04/90/avatars/267-90.jpg)
Number of posts : 2037 Age : 75 Location : Kenna, WV Registration date : 2009-07-13
![what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them April 15th 2011, 8:10 pm | |
| Bighorns will take you anywhere you want to go in this area. And they wear pretty well. | |
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wvprowler
![wvprowler](https://2img.net/u/1913/21/04/90/avatars/518-56.jpg)
Number of posts : 325 Age : 51 Location : Clarks Gap/Herndon Mountain Registration date : 2010-02-14
![what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them April 15th 2011, 9:17 pm | |
| i have the new sedona rip saw rt tires and they are the best i have run and they dont clog up in the mud like the big horns !!!!! and they dont cost as much either .i have around 1800 miles on mine now they still look the same as they did the day i put them on . | |
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Bobby D
![Bobby D](https://2img.net/u/1913/21/04/90/avatars/2-19.jpg)
Number of posts : 14579 Location : Blacksburg,Va Registration date : 2009-02-08
![what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them April 15th 2011, 10:13 pm | |
| I have had Mud Lite XL,Mud Lite XTRs,Swamp Lites,Bighorns & now Interco Reptiles.
Mud Lite XL I will never buy again I was always getting holes in the sidewall
Mud Lite XTRs were better than the XL but as far as the sidewall & traction was great on both
Swap Lites seem to wear uneven & wore down quick but the traction was great
Bighorns seem to last longer & that's what you will find on most SXS but not very good in the mud
Interco Reptiles I have 1 ride on them and the traction is awesome and the ride is better I think than the Bighorns were IMO but I will have to see how long they last since they are pretty much the same as the Swap Lites but they are radials
I will only buy radial tires from now on since they ride better & make more contact with the ground for better traction.
Last edited by Bobby D on April 16th 2011, 12:26 pm; edited 1 time in total | |
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bcfatvs
Number of posts : 282 Location : Virginia Registration date : 2009-07-15
![what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them April 16th 2011, 1:15 am | |
| I say Big Horns. I like the looks of the Pit Bull Rockers, but man they are ex$pensive. I've had both the ITP Bajacross and Big Horns on mine. The ride is about the same but, Bajacross's are not that great in snow. I think the Bajacross's have a distinct advantage in mud over the Big Horns. | |
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Hump
Number of posts : 4683 Age : 45 Location : Richwood, WV Registration date : 2009-03-08
![what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them April 16th 2011, 2:03 am | |
| I like my bighorns, and will likely have another set of them. They are not a great mudder, but they ain't to bad. In snow, I don't think they can be beat. If you hold it wide open in snow, there is no wheel hop, and they have great floatation. The only other tires I have had on a sxs is Mudlite XLs, and the stock Maxxis that came on the rhino. Mudlites are not for agressive riding due to thin sidewalls, and they have no side bite at all. I have had two sets, and had a tire in both sets that will not hold air for no apparent reason. I love my bighorns, but whatever you buy, make sure it's a radial. The wide contact patch of a radial offers much more traction on most trails than just about any bias ply tire out there. Plus, the ride and handling is much better. | |
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Rainemaker
![Rainemaker](https://2img.net/u/1913/21/04/90/avatars/843-45.jpg)
Number of posts : 47 Age : 49 Location : Corydon, In Registration date : 2010-10-16
![what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them April 16th 2011, 2:09 am | |
| I have my stock Big horns and are great for most things. Mud not so much but any thing else they work really well. Also have a set of SuperATV Terminators just for when I want to play in the Mud. Have not had any time on the trail with them yet will be glad to let everyone know how they do.
Pitbull Growlers look to be a pretty nice tire, friend of mine runs them and they have killer grip. To new on his machine to report how well they wear though. His comment about them is " I really think I could climb a tree with these things" | |
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pit dog
![pit dog](https://2img.net/u/1913/21/04/90/avatars/499-41.jpg)
Number of posts : 4423 Age : 64 Location : charleston WV Registration date : 2010-01-28
![what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them April 16th 2011, 2:51 pm | |
| I have 800 miles on my pit bull growlers. They are awesome bite is great ride is super smooth,clean out great. Do a lot better than the big horns not week sidewalls like the mud lites. Are 8 ply no flats or issues yet. Rimgards are great. They are a little heavy. So far I love them. | |
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Jet
![Jet](https://2img.net/u/1913/21/04/90/avatars/1164-84.jpg)
Number of posts : 4150 Age : 73 Location : Canal Winchester Ohio 43110 Registration date : 2011-04-19
![what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them May 8th 2011, 9:12 pm | |
| since the majority of my riding will be here in Ohio at Wayne National Forest which is mud heaven or hell depending on how you look at it, so the Bajacross's would be better? and they will work in west by god too? i figure the stock maxxis stuff should go sooner or later. thanks. Dave. | |
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big g
![big g](https://2img.net/u/1913/21/04/90/avatars/509-90.jpg)
Number of posts : 3689 Age : 65 Location : Stokesdale N.C-HillTop WVA Registration date : 2010-02-04
![what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them May 8th 2011, 10:30 pm | |
| bighorns they seem to work pretty good in WVA | |
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porkchop
![porkchop](https://2img.net/u/1913/21/04/90/avatars/33-20.jpg)
Number of posts : 576 Age : 61 Location : Rock Hill S.C. Registration date : 2009-02-13
![what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them May 8th 2011, 10:39 pm | |
| Big horns for me , got them on all ny machines ( 2 rzr's and 1 atv ) and knock on wood "NO PLUGS IN ANY OF THEM " ! but one thing to remember is what ever tire you decide on be sure to run enough air pressure in them ! every tire I have seen that had flats they were running about 6 to 8 lbs of air and that is not enough for the sxs's ! I run 11 to 12 lbs on the 14" rims and 10 to 11 on the 12" rims ! just pick a tire YOU like and get the pressure right to much is better than not enough !!!!! | |
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Guest Guest
![Anonymous](https://2img.net/u/1913/21/04/90/avatars/gallery/red_rz11.gif)
![what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them May 8th 2011, 10:59 pm | |
| 2000 miles on my bighorns and no plugs and i run 6 to 8 psi. and they still have at least 1000 miles left in them |
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BRP RIDER
![BRP RIDER](https://2img.net/u/1913/21/04/90/avatars/208-66.jpg)
Number of posts : 216 Age : 61 Location : WISE VIRGINIA Registration date : 2009-05-29
![what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them May 8th 2011, 11:14 pm | |
| I HAVE HAD THE GBC DIRT TAMERS ON BOTH OF MY RZR'S THEY ARE A BIAS PLY SPIN-OFF OF THE BIG HORNS. THEY HOLD UP REAL WELL. AFTER THE FALL RIDE LAST YEAR I BOUGHT A SET OF 27" RACELINE TIRES FROM DISCOUNT TIRE FOR A GREAT DEAL AND THEY RIDE ON THEM AT THE SPRING RIDE REALLY SUPRISED ME WAS ONLY 1 TIME IN THE 2 DAY'S I RODE THAT I PUT IT IN 4-WHEEL DRIVE THEY SEEM TO BITE IN WELL IN MUD AND GO GOOD IN THE ROCKS. ![what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them 840768](https://2img.net/u/1913/21/04/90/smiles/840768.gif) | |
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Guest Guest
![Anonymous](https://2img.net/u/1913/21/04/90/avatars/gallery/red_rz11.gif)
![what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them May 9th 2011, 10:17 am | |
| I have radial Bighorns on the RZR and GBC Grim Reapers on the Rhino. |
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Rainemaker
![Rainemaker](https://2img.net/u/1913/21/04/90/avatars/843-45.jpg)
Number of posts : 47 Age : 49 Location : Corydon, In Registration date : 2010-10-16
![what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them May 9th 2011, 5:01 pm | |
| For mudding I have the superATV terminators on my commander and LOVE them. I finally got a chance to test them out. They ride really smooth on the trail or road (I was surprised) and when you are in ANY mud you will not have to worry about getting stuck. A bit of warning though, do not get behind someone who has a set of these mounted. They throw pretty big chunks and clean out really well, so there will be mud flying off them.
I pulled up a pretty steep hill that was really muddy, from all this great rain we have here in Kentucky, i dug ruts and was slinging mud all the way up. Few four wheelers wouldn't even try to make the hill, it was way to sloppy for them.
Another tip: do not stick your head out over the edge to check out your new cleats. Just a bad idea, will just take you a second to get covered :)
Have not had a chance to run them on hard pack but I imagine a big horn type tire / tread would be much better for this terrain. It has not stopped raining here long enough to try my terminators out on anything dry.
The stock big horns (2.0's) are a great tire if you are going to be racing your machine. But I have found that they are just way to thin for the abuse I give my machine. Easy to slice up when riding in rough terrain. Once I trash all of mine I will not get another set of the 2.0's. Wish Can AM would have used the regular Big Horns on the Commander seems like a much better choice for the general public. As far as tread design though they are a pretty good tire, I didn't have a lot of luck with them in the mud but for everything else they are great. The 4 ply big horns (2.0's) are just to thin, the regular big horns would be much better.
Can't wait to get in front of TBone with my terminators and get him a little dirty. From what I hear any Grandma on a lawn mower should be able to get around him! | |
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Jet
![Jet](https://2img.net/u/1913/21/04/90/avatars/1164-84.jpg)
Number of posts : 4150 Age : 73 Location : Canal Winchester Ohio 43110 Registration date : 2011-04-19
![what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them May 9th 2011, 6:21 pm | |
| rainemaker: thanks for the info and TBone if what he says is true (doubt it-lol) i got your back brother. i'll be right behind you. lol. | |
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wvprowler
![wvprowler](https://2img.net/u/1913/21/04/90/avatars/518-56.jpg)
Number of posts : 325 Age : 51 Location : Clarks Gap/Herndon Mountain Registration date : 2010-02-14
![what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them May 9th 2011, 10:31 pm | |
| i am telling you try the new sedona rip saw rt tires they are a radil tire and they go better then the big horns .they are as lite as the bighorns and i have a little over 2000 miles on mine now and no problems what so ever and they still look new. and you cant beat the price of them either i have the 26 x11x14 and the 26x9x14 for $422 mounted .and if they are for the 12 inch rims i can get them for $350 mounted . | |
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kennylacy
Number of posts : 251 Age : 55 Location : Crab Orchard, wv Registration date : 2011-02-11
![what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them May 9th 2011, 10:41 pm | |
| What ever you do don't get Bighorns confused with the Bighorn 2.0 my commander came with 2.0's and they are worthless. I have had 2 sidewalls cut and had to go buy new wheels and tires at less than a 1000 miles. I bought stock base wheels and cheap tires untill I can get real 8 ply bighorns to go on my good wheels. | |
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Jet
![Jet](https://2img.net/u/1913/21/04/90/avatars/1164-84.jpg)
Number of posts : 4150 Age : 73 Location : Canal Winchester Ohio 43110 Registration date : 2011-04-19
![what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them July 28th 2011, 10:28 pm | |
| bobby, what size are the reptiles on your rzr. i'm thinking of buying a set of tires for my LE rims to ride in Ohio. alot of mud here, how are they in mud, not deep mud bogs here, just muddy trails. | |
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Guest Guest
![Anonymous](https://2img.net/u/1913/21/04/90/avatars/gallery/red_rz11.gif)
![what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them July 29th 2011, 5:23 pm | |
| Probably gonna make a few mad but, Big Horns suck!
After looking at all the options, just bought 27x12x12 Swap Lites for the RZR. The Swap Lites are replacing my Big Horns. I have GBC Grim Reapers on the Rhino and really like them, however they do not make a 27" for 12" rims or I would have put them on the RZR. I liked the Sedona Rip Saws but had a hard time finding information on them and a local dealer selling them.
IMHO Big Horns are way overrated, pricey, and heavy. They clog badly in the mud and are average at best when it come to grip. Spent a week at Brimstone; I watched the GBCs on the Rhino grap and climb easliy where the Big Horns slipped and spun. I am not a fan of Big Horns and was not impressed with them. |
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tracker1
Number of posts : 148 Age : 75 Location : Ottumwa, Ia Registration date : 2010-06-16
![what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them July 29th 2011, 9:29 pm | |
| - wvprowler wrote:
- i am telling you try the new sedona rip saw rt tires they are a radil tire and they go better then the big horns .they are as lite as the bighorns and i have a little over 2000 miles on mine now and no problems what so ever and they still look new. and you cant beat the price of them either i have the 26 x11x14 and the 26x9x14 for $422 mounted .and if they are for the 12 inch rims i can get them for $350 mounted .
I'am thinking about these where can you get these for $350 | |
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Hump
Number of posts : 4683 Age : 45 Location : Richwood, WV Registration date : 2009-03-08
![what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them July 31st 2011, 3:35 am | |
| - RZR_Joe wrote:
- Probably gonna make a few mad but, Big Horns suck!
After looking at all the options, just bought 27x12x12 Swap Lites for the RZR. The Swap Lites are replacing my Big Horns. I have GBC Grim Reapers on the Rhino and really like them, however they do not make a 27" for 12" rims or I would have put them on the RZR. I liked the Sedona Rip Saws but had a hard time finding information on them and a local dealer selling them.
IMHO Big Horns are way overrated, pricey, and heavy. They clog badly in the mud and are average at best when it come to grip. Spent a week at Brimstone; I watched the GBCs on the Rhino grap and climb easliy where the Big Horns slipped and spun. I am not a fan of Big Horns and was not impressed with them. The Bighorns are the best tire I've had, but I haven't had alot of different tires to compare them to. And, they are the only tire I have any experience with on a rzr. Compared to everything else I've had they are the best yet overall. By that I mean for the trails I ride most of the time, and I'm talking about tread life, puncture resistance, ride smoothness, and high speed handling. I would love to find a tire that does all those things as well as Bighorns with more traction. But it seems to me that a more agressive tire just won't go the miles and be as smooth as the Bighorns. I have noticed that after 1200 miles I've lost some side bite. Keeping the rear going straight seems to be getting harder to do. I'm sure the swamplites are amazing, but I've heard they wear very quickly. Thanks for the honesty, even if you bash my favorite tire. I almost never buy the same tire twice, and that goes for truck tires too. I'm always looking for something that will do better for ME than what I have now. It's hard to just guess and try a set because they cost so much. Seems with every tread design there is a tradeoff. If it's true kick ass tire in mud it's gonna suck on smooth rock and hard pack, and it's gonna ride like crap. If it grips the rocks, sticks like glue on the wet hard pack stuff, it's most likely not the best mud tire. Of all the mods a person can make to one of these, I think tire choice is the toughest, and most important. | |
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Guest Guest
![Anonymous](https://2img.net/u/1913/21/04/90/avatars/gallery/red_rz11.gif)
![what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them July 31st 2011, 9:44 am | |
| - Quote :
- Of all the mods a person can make to one of these, I think tire choice is the toughest, and most important.
Very true and well said! And yes any choice is a compromise to achieve, key is to pick what works for the individual. BH ride great, are super tough, and wear great, but traction suffers. I think there are cheaper alternatives like BGC Dirt Tamers are 2/3 the price. |
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Finzup
![Finzup](https://2img.net/u/1913/21/04/90/avatars/267-90.jpg)
Number of posts : 2037 Age : 75 Location : Kenna, WV Registration date : 2009-07-13
![what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them July 31st 2011, 10:55 am | |
| - Yamabeast wrote:
- RZR_Joe wrote:
- Probably gonna make a few mad but, Big Horns suck!
After looking at all the options, just bought 27x12x12 Swap Lites for the RZR. The Swap Lites are replacing my Big Horns. I have GBC Grim Reapers on the Rhino and really like them, however they do not make a 27" for 12" rims or I would have put them on the RZR. I liked the Sedona Rip Saws but had a hard time finding information on them and a local dealer selling them.
IMHO Big Horns are way overrated, pricey, and heavy. They clog badly in the mud and are average at best when it come to grip. Spent a week at Brimstone; I watched the GBCs on the Rhino grap and climb easliy where the Big Horns slipped and spun. I am not a fan of Big Horns and was not impressed with them.
The Bighorns are the best tire I've had, but I haven't had alot of different tires to compare them to. And, they are the only tire I have any experience with on a rzr. Compared to everything else I've had they are the best yet overall. By that I mean for the trails I ride most of the time, and I'm talking about tread life, puncture resistance, ride smoothness, and high speed handling. I would love to find a tire that does all those things as well as Bighorns with more traction. But it seems to me that a more agressive tire just won't go the miles and be as smooth as the Bighorns. I have noticed that after 1200 miles I've lost some side bite. Keeping the rear going straight seems to be getting harder to do. I'm sure the swamplites are amazing, but I've heard they wear very quickly. Thanks for the honesty, even if you bash my favorite tire. I almost never buy the same tire twice, and that goes for truck tires too. I'm always looking for something that will do better for ME than what I have now. It's hard to just guess and try a set because they cost so much. Seems with every tread design there is a tradeoff. If it's true kick ass tire in mud it's gonna suck on smooth rock and hard pack, and it's gonna ride like crap. If it grips the rocks, sticks like glue on the wet hard pack stuff, it's most likely not the best mud tire.
Of all the mods a person can make to one of these, I think tire choice is the toughest, and most important. I agree w/ RZR Joe, well said. I find this forum invaluable in helping me decide expensive purchases. I once bought the most knobby, trick looking maxxis tire for my dirt bike and ended up cutting off a pattern of lugs to get it to clean out in the mud. Go figure. | |
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Bobby D
![Bobby D](https://2img.net/u/1913/21/04/90/avatars/2-19.jpg)
Number of posts : 14579 Location : Blacksburg,Va Registration date : 2009-02-08
![what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them July 31st 2011, 9:57 pm | |
| - Jetdriverx wrote:
- bobby, what size are the reptiles on your rzr. i'm thinking of buying a set of tires for my LE rims to ride in Ohio. alot of mud here, how are they in mud, not deep mud bogs here, just muddy trails.
27/9/14 & 27/11/14 | |
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Jet
![Jet](https://2img.net/u/1913/21/04/90/avatars/1164-84.jpg)
Number of posts : 4150 Age : 73 Location : Canal Winchester Ohio 43110 Registration date : 2011-04-19
![what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them Empty](https://2img.net/i/empty.gif) | Subject: Re: what tires do you guys like and experiences you have with them July 31st 2011, 9:58 pm | |
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